Lady R, I am well aware of the responsibility of each and every individual for the choices they make. At no time did I give the impression or state that those involved in crime should be absolved of their responsibility because of any of the influences or motivations they had.

Having said that, let me ask you:

If little Johnny was influenced by little Adam to rape and kill little Sally, is little Adam blameless in the proceedings because he did not commit the acts himself, or is he manipulative, exploitive, and just as evil and responsible for orchestrating such dastardly acts?

All I have been saying is that there is more to crime and violence in Jamaica than is obvious. US influence is one such factor. Yes Jamaican criminals are responsible for their actions, but the US is responsible for it's part as well. In the case of the shower posse and the events which took place in the 70s and early 80s in Jamaica, the US definitely has a responsibility. And it was those events which essentially spawned the criminal landscape that exists in Jamaica today.

The guns came into Jamaica from the US because of politics. They guns found new use with the drug trade. With time that expanded to extortion and other organized criminal activities.


So why do you take such offence when I mention the crimes of the US in relation to Jamaica's situation? You know the US has its hands dirty. They've intefered with countries all over the globe and exploited the disadvantaged there for their own agenda. That makes them just as responsible for the bad things that happen there as a result of their interference.

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"Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake." - Matthew 5 v11 KJV

Very waggish indeed.

I think you missread me. if you have read ANY of my post...you will see that i hold no allegience to the USA! i do not sing its praises or spot off how im proud to be an American. I do understand the benefits of being born to this county...but a patriot, i am not! i see the world as it is...this country...my ppl all of it! So i am not offended by your comments toward the US. Its just tiresome to see that no matta what is wrong with JA, its the fault of the USA! But I think you fail to see that the USA could not have done the things they have done without the help of the JAMAICAN govenrnment! the greedy backdoor dealing JA politicians! the ppl who are supposed to be protecting and building JA up are the main ppl who continue to rape your economy and county for thier own gain. STOP BLAMING US!---

the reasons black ppl in this contry are still behind in this country, the reasons our families are broken, the reasons why our communites are divided is a direct result of slavery! I cannot continue to blame slavery for why my ppl are not taking advantage of getting a college education. I cannot continue to blame slavery for why my ppl are destroying our communities. i connot continue to blame slavery for why things are the way they are now!!!!!! YES slavery impacted us so much so that is is still seen and felt in every aspect of our lives....BUT now we have to take responsiblity and build ourselves up...take rsponisblity for our families and our community! we just cant sit and wollow in the situation and continue to BLAME the past for our future!

that said, i will say, that little adam is a little manipulative, violent and dangerous indiviual...but little johny is the one whos face is on the front page of the news shaming his family...HE is the one that will be somebody's "babylove" in prison!--he has no one but himself to blame!

I hear you loud and clear. Like I said, at no time did I state that Jamaicans involved in criminal activities, politicians or otherwise, were not responsible for their actions and the results of them. Neither did I advocate wallowing in self-pity etc. But to move forward, one needs to understand the root causes of the situation. That includes knowing the roles of all of those involved. Without this, you are doomed to repeat the mistakes of the past.

I will say though, that just as how you get somewhat irritated when reference is made to the US responsibility in Jamaica's situation, so to do Jamaicans get irritated when people from the US speak about Jamaica as if we are the most violent people on earth, and that nothing close to what happens here could happen there, when in fact, it can, and has, and things are more linked than most want to acknowledge.

As a Jamaican, I don't want to be thought of to be negative by default, just because there are some Jamaicans that are negative. We aren't all like that.

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"Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake." - Matthew 5 v11 KJV

Very waggish indeed.

i thought we would have to agree to disagree on this point...

but i find that we are in complete agreement! in this case...LOL

i feel you cuz i get irritated when ppl assume ALL americans are spoiled, rich, rude, uncultured ppl....but i do understand why they feel that way though!

ppl see what they want! (no matter whats right in thier face) they still see whats easy for them to accept!---but do give some ppl credit for seeing the truth!

Speaking about the Shower Posse, the US is set to deport its leader, Vivian Blake.

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"Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake." - Matthew 5 v11 KJV

Very waggish indeed.

And here is injustice United States style...

that man should never be released from prison. Funny how you can be convicted of a crime, but can get a "plea deal" and get out!....No such thing should ever occur. Bargin?

funny! --Its true what they say... a rich man never have to serve his time in jail. If you have money in the US....it pays for every and anything...even freedom and first class travel back "home".

not funny attall!

damn I hate to say this but...good post!

Well, this is true. 8 years isn't enough jailtime. When he returns to Jamaica, he will be a free man. There are no charges against him here. The fear, of course, is that he will return, and usher in a new age of sophisticated criminality with the knowledge and experience gained abroad. This is often the case with deportees. They come back significantly more savvy in their criminality than when they left.

__________________
"Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake." - Matthew 5 v11 KJV

Very waggish indeed.

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i will continue to pray for JA...............

The Shower Posse (JLP) and their equally vicious but opposing counterpart, Spangler Posse(PNP) were undoubtedly influenced by the jamaican politicians as well as covert agencies of both United States and Cuba, respectively.

They both started as rival street gangs in Western and Central Kingston supporting the two major political parties, in the political hey days of the 70's and gained prominence as we approcahed the 1980 election era when the local political market was flooded with automatic weapons from both US and soviet bloc countries. It was during this time when the then Prime Minsiter Michael Manley after being shunned (so to speak) by the IMF and the World Bank, sought refuge in the arms of uncle Fidel along with Prime Ministers, Maurice Bishop (Grenanda) and Forbes Burnham (Guyana) declared his full allegiance with Cuba's socialistic-communism policies. This infuriated the US and also placed the "heat" on the then opposition JLP party and cause many of their gang members to flee to the States.

Many of the then rival gangs regrouped in areas such as NY, Philly, NJ, DC ,Bridgeport and Hartford CT, where they began a rampage of crime and violence to control the drug trade, leaving murder and bloodshed in their wake.

The infamous shower posse gained dominance by their trademark signature of "showering" bullets on their victims and leavingthem almost unrecognizable.

Whos's to be blamed? No one I guess. They were just another gang used as a pawn towards a political end. They were left alone to florish just as long as they kept in line and served their purpose. When they were no longer needed and posed a threat of political embarrasment, they were hunted down, killed, imprisoned and otherwise eliminated.
Vivian though a cold-blooded murder to soem and a Robin Hood to others was just another pawn in the game.

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Magnify your God, don't magnify your problems.

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My President is BLACK and I'm oh so proud to be a African American... Everybody always have to throw blame at the US for everything. I recently was invited to the Gambia by His Excellency President Jahya Jammeh. He said that all Diasporas should return home in search of their Roots. The private audience with His Excellency was so powerful that I could careless about who want to say what about us in America if its so bad stay out... I invite you all to attend the Roots Festival in 2010. Maybe then you will learn to respect each others opinions and differences. My President is Black and my BMW is too. We all have the same Blood from the Motherland running through our veins.

My President is BLACK and I'm oh so proud to be a African American... Everybody always have to throw blame at the US for everything. I recently was invited to the Gambia by His Excellency President Jahya Jammeh. He said that all Diasporas should return home in search of their Roots. The private audience with His Excellency was so powerful that I could careless about who want to say what about us in America if its so bad stay out... I invite you all to attend the Roots Festival in 2010. Maybe then you will learn to respect each others opinions and differences. My President is Black and my BMW is too. We all have the same Blood from the Motherland running through our veins. I was married to a Shower Member we have a daughter and he was a kind man. I'm not from the Ghetto I am educated, matter of fact I had a Rolex and my own business when I met him. He told me all the myths he was told prior to coming to the States and he found them all to be a lie.

I know Vivian Blake and he is a Good Man. So you all go on back and forth. The bottomline is we all need to just get along. One Love..

Hmmmmmmm ......

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"Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake." - Matthew 5 v11 KJV

Very waggish indeed.